"Though recruiters report that start-up salaries for engineers rose 20 to 30 percent in the past year and a half, to upwards of $140,000 for a developer with three to five years experience, that still leaves start-ups priced out of top talent in a city where working for a hedge fund can mean bonuses of up to 80 percent on a good year and CTOs command seven figures."
As a developer at a tech startup in NYC I always hear figures like this and they seem kind of mythical. My friends in the startup world tend to feel the same. Are there only a handful of companies paying this kind of money (Google, Gilt, Etsy, etc.) while everyone else pays considerably lower?
All the VC funded startups I've seen compensation for up close are in the 90-120k for what I'd consider junior to middle level non-founder engineers (half that for founders), and maybe 130-160 for individual contributors of great but not legendary caliber (i.e. not hiring Guido to do python dev for 160k, but someone who is quite good, and who could easily be a top tier consultant in that field).
These salaries (for VC funded companies after a big A, B, etc,) are about 2x of what I'd consider reasonable (which is a view based on salaries 2001-2005), but being on the employer side, if you have the money, not being willing to pay market is a dumb reason to not get the best talent. Paying market itself isn't a differentiator, but it's reasonable for an employee to be unwilling to take a substantially below market total comp package. If you don't have the cash, obviously you need to build in other parts of comp to make up for it (flexibility, being in lower cost areas, higher equity, ...), but it seems like angels and VCs value equity a lot more than employees do, and value cash a lot less, so raising more money to pay the bigger salaries isn't wrong.
What are the salaries you're hearing? It makes sense that recruiters, who are more likely to be hired by VCs who've invested millions in a start-up, would report higher rates than start-ups without that kind of funding.
Really? I can't find any companies willing to offer me anything better than $50,000 with NO benefits. I have five years of professional experience (three at startups) in pretty diverse stuff (C, Ruby, PHP, Erlang, full-stack web dev, system administration, scaling... etc.)
Where are you sending your resume? As a VC funded start-up in San Francisco we see lots of resumes, just not lots of great ones. And so we pay. $140k base for most positions. And we're open to telecommuting and relo. Its just even harder to find remote engineers then local ones. If your interested, ping me ;)
I'm looking for (preferably) remote work. If you have an interesting project, I am interested. :)
As I mentioned in the other comment, I used to live/work in SF. I'd ping you, but I need some contact info!
EDIT: Are you triggit.com? I also know quite a bit about advertising/marketing (CPM, CPA, CPC, PPV, affiliate, incentive, etc.) and I'd love to work with it again.
Sorry, I should have mentioned I'm looking for remote work primarily, though I have applied to many local non-startups. I'm currently in New England, but previously lived and worked in San Francisco at venture-backed startups.
Agreed. At the startup I work for I went into a review asking for what I considered a bump to market level and the number I proposed, though not as high as 140 was still met with an "uhhh" type response. I was told most candidates coming in were asking for my salary range at the time or lower, and I believe them.
Tip: "Market rate" is what someone else is willing to pay you. Go to your boss with a better offer from elsewhere and they will change their tune fast!
Pro Tip: they'll give you that raise until the project you're on is completed. Then they'll give you the boot. Price/resume shoppers not only cause a lot of headaches if their success becomes apparent to others within the organization, but the bosses rarely like being held hostage to outside influencers.
In a start-up, that type of behavior is rarely rewarded in the long term as founders tend to be people who develop relationships based on trust and loyalty and who also talk amongst themselves and you'll run the risk of being blackballed. Do it once if you feel underpaid, but don't expect much upside after that.
My advice is to look for a job, consider offers and take the one that fits what you're looking for in compensation/organization. In the future, your current employer may reassess your value and hire you back at a higher scale. I've seen this happen before.
Why is it a headache when an employee compares offers, but ok when a company tries to pay as little as they can get away with?
BTW, this only works if you're willing to leave for the much better offer. It sounded like the OP was unhappy with his pay. Nothing wrong with that. From what I've seen, though, substantial raises come from switching jobs and counter offers. If you're happy with your work and pay, then by all means stay.
1. Your manager there is concerned with building their fiefdom and without a loyal crew, they know they won't succeed internally. They'll have little time for your negotiations skills and will be very unimpressed if you bring up offers from unknown starts-ups. They're a manager at a Fortune 500 company, dontcha know? It's their life and chosen career, not to mention their lifeline. You're dead to them once you leave or hint of leaving for more money.
2. Salary levels and compensation packages are designed and set by professional HR crew whose job it is to keep labor costs down and weed out malcontents. Where do they get their salary guidelines? From industry groups and consultants who specialize in companies of that size and who share that same info with every one of their clients. Good luck walking around with an offer from a similar-sized competitor. They'll be on the phone to them, probably friends, telling them what a dunce you are and you'll find your offer rescinded. Never ever mention where you're going or what they'll be paying you. Much less at a big company.
3. No matter how big or small the organization, outside of the entertainment industry, and I include sports here, very few will be willing to tolerate a disruptive prima donna for very long. Especially rank and file developers with visions of grandeur brought on by big money stories and newly acquired skills.
Like I said, present your situation to management but don't wait around for them to bring salaries into line. Some times they simply can't, you've misread the market or your importance to them. If that's the case, don't force their hand.
As a developer at a tech startup in NYC I always hear figures like this and they seem kind of mythical. My friends in the startup world tend to feel the same. Are there only a handful of companies paying this kind of money (Google, Gilt, Etsy, etc.) while everyone else pays considerably lower?